Even More DE42LFAs (6510+)

[OrionFlyer]

According to this http://www.wmata.com/stimulus/project_details.cfm?P=Replacement%20of%20Oldest%20Buses, more DE42LFA's are on the way. It says that the newer ones started to arrive on  5/31/2010. I read on this forum that somebody said they saw 6510 or 6511 on US 50. I'm really going to miss the Flxibles. It's either going to be 6510-6556 or 6510-6557; one part says 47 buses and the other says 48.

[NewFlyer9736BCT]

I REALLY hope after all these New Flyers are done, the future orders will be anything but New Flyer.

[Annex4421]

Couldn't some of them been D42LFAs too many hybrids WMATA is becomming a 2nd MTA-NYC.

[orionvii2680]

Oh dear Lowd no....

[79MetroExtraMD]

Couldn't some of them been D42LFAs too many hybrids WMATA is becomming a 2nd MTA-NYC.

Whats wrong with having alot of hybrids? Seattle has the largest hybrid tic fleet. Saves on fuel and maintenance costs.
Nothing last forever. Eventually the Flxs would be going because they are costly to maintain even though we love em.

[WMATAGMOAGH]

But hybrids are more expensive to maintain than regular buses, according to a number of people I've spoken to.  There are some who argue the added costs of maintaining them don't justify the fuel savings.

[79MetroExtraMD]

But hybrids are more expensive to maintain than regular buses, according to a number of people I've spoken to.  There are some who argue the added costs of maintaining them don't justify the fuel savings.

Many agencies are heading in that direction. I mean eventually, costs will go down. Most new things have a high cost in the beginning but the payout over time might balance out. With the Flxs, parts are scarce and retired buses have to be cannablized for the parts unfortunately. Also, alot of people see hybrids as a new focus on environmentalism as opposed to a straight diesel bus.

[Tritransit Area]

To be honest, anyone going in with the mindset that getting hybrid buses is going to save money is going to be in for a shock.  From what I've learned, the higher initial costs of the hybrids over the diesels only evens out over the lifetime of the hybrid.   These buses are really to "help the environment" rather than to save the big bucks.  That's one reason I'm shocked that WMATA stopped putting those "Natural Gas" and "Hybrid" labels on their buses, especially the LFAs.

Wanna really save money?  Go the CNG route.  Those buses aren't as expensive, and natural gas is much cheaper than diesel.  With cleaner emissions, you don't have to get all the particulate and emission treatment stuff that you need for diesel buses, and don't have to change things like the oil as much.  Easier to work on as well.

The thing that scares people away is the fact that they have to build infrastructure and commit to this technology.  Many of those earlier pioneers were scared away from the less than stellar performance of old engines like the L10G.  It's too bad, too, because we are just sitting on an abundance of natural gas...

Back on topic, are all of these new LFAs going to sit in Maryland?

[79MetroExtraMD]

To be honest, anyone going in with the mindset that getting hybrid buses is going to save money is going to be in for a shock.  From what I've learned, the higher initial costs of the hybrids over the diesels only evens out over the lifetime of the hybrid.   These buses are really to "help the environment" rather than to save the big bucks.  That's one reason I'm shocked that WMATA stopped putting those "Natural Gas" and "Hybrid" labels on their buses, especially the LFAs.

Wanna really save money?  Go the CNG route.  Those buses aren't as expensive, and natural gas is much cheaper than diesel.  With cleaner emissions, you don't have to get all the particulate and emission treatment stuff that you need for diesel buses, and don't have to change things like the oil as much.  Easier to work on as well.

The thing that scares people away is the fact that they have to build infrastructure and commit to this technology.  Many of those earlier pioneers were scared away from the less than stellar performance of old engines like the L10G.  It's too bad, too, because we are just sitting on an abundance of natural gas...

Back on topic, are all of these new LFAs going to sit in Maryland?

Metro was probably going to go the CNG route but there was something about the Maryland garages that couldn't support it. Something. As for MTA, they definitely won't consider natural gas again after the failed 93 experiment.

The new LFAs seem to be going to Northern (at least the first batch of them). I've seen a couple in the back on Bladensburg.

[Annex4421]

Couldn't some of them been D42LFAs too many hybrids WMATA is becomming a 2nd MTA-NYC.

Whats wrong with having alot of hybrids? Seattle has the largest hybrid tic fleet. Saves on fuel and maintenance costs.
Nothing last forever. Eventually the Flxs would be going because they are costly to maintain even though we love em.

I mean if it saves money then im cool wit it but as a busfan im saying it'll get a little boring after a while.

[WMATAGMOAGH]

To be honest, anyone going in with the mindset that getting hybrid buses is going to save money is going to be in for a shock.  From what I've learned, the higher initial costs of the hybrids over the diesels only evens out over the lifetime of the hybrid.   These buses are really to "help the environment" rather than to save the big bucks.  That's one reason I'm shocked that WMATA stopped putting those "Natural Gas" and "Hybrid" labels on their buses, especially the LFAs.

Wanna really save money?  Go the CNG route.  Those buses aren't as expensive, and natural gas is much cheaper than diesel.  With cleaner emissions, you don't have to get all the particulate and emission treatment stuff that you need for diesel buses, and don't have to change things like the oil as much.  Easier to work on as well.

The thing that scares people away is the fact that they have to build infrastructure and commit to this technology.  Many of those earlier pioneers were scared away from the less than stellar performance of old engines like the L10G.  It's too bad, too, because we are just sitting on an abundance of natural gas...

Back on topic, are all of these new LFAs going to sit in Maryland?

Metro was probably going to go the CNG route but there was something about the Maryland garages that couldn't support it. Something. As for MTA, they definitely won't consider natural gas again after the failed 93 experiment.

The new LFAs seem to be going to Northern (at least the first batch of them). I've seen a couple in the back on Bladensburg.

There was no issue with the Maryland garages being able to support CNG.  The reason that Maryland never got CNG buses is that Robert Smith, who was WMATA Board Chair at the time that the buses would have been purchased and an appointee of Governor Erlich, believed that it would be more economical to buy clean diesel and hybrid buses (i.e. the 6000s and 6100s) than to install the CNG infrastructure and buy CNG buses.

[79MetroExtraMD]

To be honest, anyone going in with the mindset that getting hybrid buses is going to save money is going to be in for a shock.  From what I've learned, the higher initial costs of the hybrids over the diesels only evens out over the lifetime of the hybrid.   These buses are really to "help the environment" rather than to save the big bucks.  That's one reason I'm shocked that WMATA stopped putting those "Natural Gas" and "Hybrid" labels on their buses, especially the LFAs.

Wanna really save money?  Go the CNG route.  Those buses aren't as expensive, and natural gas is much cheaper than diesel.  With cleaner emissions, you don't have to get all the particulate and emission treatment stuff that you need for diesel buses, and don't have to change things like the oil as much.  Easier to work on as well.

The thing that scares people away is the fact that they have to build infrastructure and commit to this technology.  Many of those earlier pioneers were scared away from the less than stellar performance of old engines like the L10G.  It's too bad, too, because we are just sitting on an abundance of natural gas...

Back on topic, are all of these new LFAs going to sit in Maryland?

Metro was probably going to go the CNG route but there was something about the Maryland garages that couldn't support it. Something. As for MTA, they definitely won't consider natural gas again after the failed 93 experiment.

The new LFAs seem to be going to Northern (at least the first batch of them). I've seen a couple in the back on Bladensburg.

There was no issue with the Maryland garages being able to support CNG.  The reason that Maryland never got CNG buses is that Robert Smith, who was WMATA Board Chair at the time that the buses would have been purchased and an appointee of Governor Erlich, believed that it would be more economical to buy clean diesel and hybrid buses (i.e. the 6000s and 6100s) than to install the CNG infrastructure and buy CNG buses.

Oh yea. That. I remember that. Even now, I doubt any Maryland garages will get CNG infrastructure.

[NewFlyer9736BCT]

If they really want to save money then I say make the investment and install the CNG infrastructure. This would also help with bus assignments on account of the CNGs will have more places to go than just FMR and Bladensburg.

[Annex4421]

Well don't worry everyone after these LFAs 102 Hybrids are gonna be left so the Flx B's or E's are gonna stay until next year.

[Scrabbleship]

Well don't worry everyone after these LFAs 102 Hybrids are gonna be left so the Flx B's or E's are gonna stay until next year.

I think the B's are toast and all that remains will be the E's. Those B's deserve a fair retirement at this point.