After two weekends of being shut down, still expect delays between Fort Totten and Takoma (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/getthere/2009/08/red_line_delays_continue.html#_login?at=u%3Djdb820%26t%3D1251126751%26e%3Dapps%2B41245586762.16102310.5101987c9a1ba7632fc678aad7dab41d%40proxymail.facebook.com%26h%3DgO8nu7eA%2FxoTK30KguJD1Q%3D%3D)
Blog ranting aside, I have an odd feeling that Jeanice McMillian is going to be to Washington what Layton Gibson was to New York: an operator death which permanently changes the system.
I want Catoe's job too and have said such since 06/22.
Who is Layton?
and to answer your question, yes but not until it is totally rebuilt.
Quote from: Antozilla on August 24, 2009, 11:25:30 AM
I want Catoe's job too and have said such since 06/22.
Who is Layton?
and to answer your question, yes but not until it is totally rebuilt.
Layton Gibson was a motorman who died in a crash similar to the Fort Totten crash, only that it was on the Williamsburg Bridge and his train was out of service (http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/1995/06/06/1995-06-06_subway_crash_wreaks_havoc_dr.html). The MTA used that as force majure to permanently slow the system down and put timers in place.
And why would the lack of a total rebuild keep the current situation going if the last two weekends were to fix the broken track circuit? Seems kind of pointless, yes?
I bet Ride On wishes they weren't doing the merge of the 6 and 37 now...
What does the 6/37 merge have to do with any of this?
I think it is a bit too early to tell what long-term effects the Fort Totten crash will have on WMATA. I think most of the responses thus far have been overreactions to the public and media that weren't nearly as necessary as those who suggested them thought they were.
Quote from: Scrabbleship on August 24, 2009, 12:19:29 PM
Quote from: Antozilla on August 24, 2009, 11:25:30 AM
I want Catoe's job too and have said such since 06/22.
Who is Layton?
and to answer your question, yes but not until it is totally rebuilt.
Layton Gibson was a motorman who died in a crash similar to the Fort Totten crash, only that it was on the Williamsburg Bridge and his train was out of service (http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/1995/06/06/1995-06-06_subway_crash_wreaks_havoc_dr.html). The MTA used that as force majure to permanently slow the system down and put timers in place.
And why would the lack of a total rebuild keep the current situation going if the last two weekends were to fix the broken track circuit? Seems kind of pointless, yes?
I bet Ride On wishes they weren't doing the merge of the 6 and 37 now...
The merging of 6/37 is OFF TOPIC.
HOWEVER. . .
with all the traffic tie ups at Conn & Knowles ave in Kensington, the route 6/37 to Potomac is geared to have massive delays from Grovesner Station to Potomac Center.
I had the 37's in 1990. . did it for 2 pics (Till they made my run a Thur/Fri off, instead of Sat/Sun off). It was a SWEET run then. . drive 15-20 min, sit at potomac. Drive 10-15 back to the Metro, sit 10-15 min & REPEAT.
I wonder when Ride-On will have to readjust 6/37 pairings, to keep the service to Potomac running on time.
Quote from: WMATAGMOAGH on August 24, 2009, 01:27:25 PM
What does the 6/37 merge have to do with any of this?
This person from the Post comments had this to say
Quote
This is getting beyond ridiculous...this is actually slower than it was a month ago. What the $*%& is going on?! And on top of it you've got Ride-On discontinuing a couple of route sections on 9/6 that go between the branches of the red line (Rte 6...) to avoid the mess.
ERGH! Can't public transit coordinate any better than this???
They aren't the first person there to notice this. It seems that the 6 has gotten a bump of ridership between the legs of the Red Line getting off at Grosvenor instead of Wheaton to dodge the backups.
QuoteI think it is a bit too early to tell what long-term effects the Fort Totten crash will have on WMATA. I think most of the responses thus far have been overreactions to the public and media that weren't nearly as necessary as those who suggested them thought they were.
Maybe it's my pessimistic self, but I have a sinking feeling the days of ATO and reasonable platform stops are dead until the 7000's come in.
I don't see what effect the merge will have on the people who want to get to Grosvenor aside from the potential for adjusted trip times.
In the mornings, eastbound service from Potomac to Grosvenor should be fine for the people in Potomac. You raise an interesting point about afternoons. I do think this is a good change. A number of reverse commuters on the 37 came off the J5 in the mornings and vice versa in the evenings, and I wouldn't be surprised if having the bus going to Wheaton will be more convenient for them, reduce their (long) travel times, and maybe even eliminate a transfer for some of them.
I was a daily 37 rider for 4 years, and from talking to the drivers, it was as sweet when I rode it as when you drove it. I don't think I ever talked to a single driver who disliked that route. It was quiet, ran on time, had "good" passengers, and long layovers. I imagine it will get interlined now that it will go over to Wheaton though.
about the red line thing...why is it that all trains are stopping at the very end of the platform since the 6/22 accident?
and if the 6 and 37 do merge, will the route number stick to being 37? and will it still cover Grosvenor Lane or stick to Tuckerman Lane?
Re the platform thing without the ATC, its to ensure the whole train gets into the station
Quote from: NewFlyer97BCT on August 25, 2009, 01:10:52 AM
about the red line thing...why is it that all trains are stopping at the very end of the platform since the 6/22 accident?
and if the 6 and 37 do merge, will the route number stick to being 37? and will it still cover Grosvenor Lane or stick to Tuckerman Lane?
I'll take your questions out of order. The 6 and 37 are merging. The 6 segment east of Grosvenor will become part of the 37 but the route is changing slightly. Parkside is still served by the 6. The routes west of Grosvenor remain the same, and the 6 regains its midday service. The details of this and also of the 18/25 changes are on the Ride On website.
The trains are pulling to the front of the platform because of incidents with 8 car trains stopping at the 6 car marker. Following the crash, in order to simplify operations and to not have other issues, they decided all trains should stop up front. Of course, if WMATA were to fix reactivate the safety system that would prevent the operators from opening the doors on the wrong side or if the train stopped short, this wouldn't be an issue, but the media hasn't reported much on it. Perhaps John Cambron can chime in on this issue a bit more, we've discussed it extensively on Subchat.
WMATAGMOAGH
The trains are pulling to the front of the platform because of incidents with 8 car trains stopping at the 6 car marker. Following the crash, in order to simplify operations and to not have other issues, they decided all trains should stop up front. Of course, if WMATA were to fix reactivate the safety system that would prevent the operators from opening the doors on the wrong side or if the train stopped short, this wouldn't be an issue, but the media hasn't reported much on it. Perhaps John Cambron can chime in on this issue a bit more, we've discussed it extensively on Subchat.
Based on my knowledge of the long stop issue. All train are stopping at the ends of the platform because they are being operated in manual mode. Because WMATA changes train lengths between peak and of peak some operator have forgotten that their 6 car trains are now 8 cars long. By stopping at the end of the platform they are guaranteed that all of the cars in their train will be on the platform.
As to the issue of returning to some level of operational normalcy. That will happen when WMATA and their contractors finish replacing all of the hardware in the Fort Totten train control room and have gone over all of the rest of the line side train control hardware with a fine tooth comb to make absolutely sure it functioning to designed specifications.
Yes, but you had explained about the track circuits and the safety system they disabled that would prevent the operators from opening the doors on an 8 car train if stopped at the 6 car marker and how that worked.
Funny thing is the consoles all display the number of cars on the train, but I can see how an 8 and 6 would look very similar on that display.
New 6, 18, 25, and 37 are posted to Ride On's website. The 37 only will operate between Wheaton and Grosvenor in the reverse peak direction (to Potomac in the AM, to Wheaton in the PM). It would be interesting to see how they blocked that, since buses are now going to need to deadhead to/from Grosvenor a fair amount I would think.
Quote from: WMATAGMOAGH on August 25, 2009, 03:16:27 PM
New 6, 18, 25, and 37 are posted to Ride On's website. The 37 only will operate between Wheaton and Grosvenor in the reverse peak direction (to Potomac in the AM, to Wheaton in the PM). It would be interesting to see how they blocked that, since buses are now going to need to deadhead to/from Grosvenor a fair amount I would think.
Looking at the new schedule. . all 37's start at Grosvener, go to Potomac, Back to Grosvenor. . and then onto Wheaton in the PM.
Looks to me like a lot of trips starting at Grosvenor in the afternoons. Hmmmmm
Well I'm the one that developed these schedules before I left Ride On and yes you guys pretty much got it right. In the AM the #37's start at Potomac, operates to Grosvenor then deadheads to Wheaton and goes back in revenue service to Potomac, the PM is vice versa. The reason we did this change was to simplify the #6 routing as we got alot of complaints from the customers in Parkside. There were other benefits to doing this as well.
The 18/25 change is the last of my legacy there. There was plenty of benefits to this change for the City of Takoma Park riders and also brought a few change in which garage operates what....
Bringing this back on topic, how is it that Metro did two weekends of shutdowns that reportedly were to fix the problem, then keep having problems when the work was done? How is that possible? Did Metro even do any work or did that as an illusion to make it seem things were getting done.
Metro needs to set up a timetable on when to fix the line, bring back ATO (and perhaps build a central control room where cameras will be in the front of the train for a cab view), and bring back automatic door control or at least allow operators to open doors from their cabs. Is this reasonable or humanly possible in WMATA-world?
Just as an aside:
The Dr. Gridlock team makes this worse by repeating news we already know. And people get pissed off. Again. (http://"http://voices.washingtonpost.com/getthere/2009/08/red_line_delays_continue_1.html#comments")
Why the Post just can't quit amazes me. They only add flames to the fire.
Quote from: Scrabbleship on August 28, 2009, 11:26:49 AM
Just as an aside:
The Dr. Gridlock team makes this worse by repeating news we already know. And people get pissed off. Again. (http://"http://voices.washingtonpost.com/getthere/2009/08/red_line_delays_continue_1.html#comments")
Why the Post just can't quit amazes me. They only add flames to the fire.
What do you want the Post to do? Not report on delays? People will bitch either way.
Quote from: Scrabbleship on August 27, 2009, 04:38:22 PM
Bringing this back on topic, how is it that Metro did two weekends of shutdowns that reportedly were to fix the problem, then keep having problems when the work was done? How is that possible? Did Metro even do any work or did that as an illusion to make it seem things were getting done.
Metro needs to set up a timetable on when to fix the line, bring back ATO (and perhaps build a central control room where cameras will be in the front of the train for a cab view), and bring back automatic door control or at least allow operators to open doors from their cabs. Is this reasonable or humanly possible in WMATA-world?
What would cameras providing a front of train view to central control do? The timetable to bring back ATO is subject to the development of a system to monitor the track circuits and bids aren't coming in for that just yet. Also, the NTSB investigation could turn up new things that they need to fix. Patience is going to be the key here. The doors are a different issue entirely, there is no reason they can't work faster to get that problem fixed and to give the operators the safety system they are used to and deserve to have. It is ridiculous that drivers are getting fired for making a mistake that is 100% preventable when the system is maintained and works properly.